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 Post subject: My first HTPC Build (04/2007 £700)
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2007 10:13 am 
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I have tinkered with HTPCs in the past, using old PCs and misc software but never a dedicated machine from the ground up. The new HD formats and x264 encoding really prompted me to get on with it because for the first time my older CPUs were just not up to the task, it was time to start looking at spending some money #-o


Use
The HTPC will be used for several purposes:

1. HD-DVD & Blu-ray HDD playback.
2. DVD & Movie files (.ts etc.)
3. Photo Library / Home Movies
4. Music server
5. Work/Office Backup storage


Design Factors
Listed below in order of priority.

1. Performance / PQ / SQ
2. Aesthetics
3. Very Quiet
4. Cool running
5. Price

It took a fair bit of research and special thanks go to ProjectHTPC for all his(her?) assistance (do you have a name btw? :) )


GPU
Playback of HD material and especially x264 is very processor intensive and bairly utilises the GPU, so it was a quick decision for me to go for onboard graphics. This not only saves a few pennies but uses less space in the case, improves airflow and most importantly reduces heat and noise.


CPU
I have always been an Intel boy, mostly by habit but I didn't see the point in straying from them now, especially as the Core2Duos seem so good and relatively cheap. In the past I always opted for the best performance I could get (within reason) and spend hundreds on CPUs. With the HTPC I was determined to keep the budget as low as possible and get only what I needed to perform the tasks at hand.

I was going for an E6320 or higher but noticed an article on the less popular E4400. It was cheaper with better performance and as with all C2D chipos, is an excellent overclocker. I somewhat nervously took the plunge.


Motherboard
My previous choices led me very quickly to the Abit F-190HD, which has the fastest ATI onboard GPU and is mATX format for compatibility with most HTPC cases. It also includes HDMI connectivity which will apeal to some, although personally I prefer the solid fit of a DVI connector.

This MB has a great BIOS with idiot-proof overclocking controls. I must just point out I have never overlocked before this PC and was very nervous about it. It was so easy to OC from 2Ghz to 3Ghz with this CPU/MB and it seems very stable and of course much faster than stock.


RAM
I tried to get away with 1gb of ram and although OK in XP it was terrible in Vista so 2GB of Geil DDR2 6400 is in there now. My only complaint is that the Heatspreaders clash with the MB :lol:


Case
This was probably the hardest decision for me and I was very close to going for the Antec Fusion as it looks good and has excellent cooling. I have the P180 tower so I know it is going to be well organised.

I am afraid the tart in me had to have the Origen AE H6, a great looking case, perfect for my AV Rack and really high build quality.

On the downside it is not laid out all that well but I suspect any case with a central DVD/VFD will have the same problems. One advantage of the all Aluminium chassis is that is aids cooling disspiating the heat very well.

It comes with fans but in all honesty you can keep them, I am fussy about noise so no stock fan would ever keep me happy. The main gripe is that the larger 80mm fan has a molex connector with no step-down resistor you can add. So unless you happen to have one lying around it runs at full tilt and is noisier than the MB controlled 40mm fans.

It also takes a Full ATX PSU which is great, I have learnt the hard way that Tagan PSUs are ideal for HTPC use as they are well shielded and include a heavy duty earch cable. Noisy PSU buzz coming through your speakers is not something I want to repeat. :-$

After much fiddling and some minor customising with fans and cables I have to say I am extremely happy with this case. Yes it did cost more and is fiddly to install some components but this is all far outweighed by the gorgeous looks IMO.


Sound
A very important factor for me was to take advantage of the new lossless HD sound formats so a good quality sound card with analogue connections was a priority. I stole the Creative X-FI Extreme from my desktop for this and it works a treat. LPCM 7.1 sounds amazing!


Storage
I started off with 2 x Samsung Spinpoint 500GB drives but ended up moving over my existing HD library form my Desktop PC. So in total there is 2TB over 4HDD in the case. This is better for me so I don't need to have more than one PC turned on to acess all the media.


OS & Software
I decided to get Vista Premium x64 as it is the future and I need to get used to it. I thought that MCE would make life easier witha one-stop integrated solution... yeah right! :roll:

IMO for music you can't beat iTunes, for HD video you only really have PowerDVD 7.3, MCE doesn't play any of my .ts files, I don't have any tuner cards so it looks like MCE will be relegated to viewing DVDs, home movies and pictures... however I suspect there is probably something else that is better than that.

MediaPortal is a better option but still a little flawed in Music/Video management I feel and I haven't tested it in Vista x64 yet.

I just wanted to add that I haven't had any problems finding x64 drivers for anything yet except FFDshow but I know it is out there somewhere :?

The HTPC is setup to dual boot Vista x64 and XP. I have added all the software in XP but not bothered texting anything yet. I am determined to get everything working right in one OS.


Remote / VFD
I haven't really looked at this yet but do intent to at some point. TBH it looks fiddly and I don't have the time, however after installing the driver it now displays the Date and Time which is better than the standard 'OrigenAE HTPC' message. In the short term I will add some basic commands to switch on/off from my programable remote. one thing to note for tree huggers is that the VFD stays on unless you power down from the PSU. I like to turn everything off at night so it is a minor consideration for some people.


Cooling / Noise
I am still waiting for a replacement CPU fan and some other quiet case fans so I will report back on this in more detail in the future. For now I would say that the stock CPU fan is very noisy IMO and not suitable for an HTPC. the other fans that come with the case are quieter but not for someone as anal about it as me :)


Performance
I will comment again when the new fans arrive but for now I would say that the HTPC is completely fit for purpose. There isn't anything I can throw at it that it won't playback.

Mpeg2 and VCI HD-DVDs and Blu-Ray utilise around 50-60% CPU power during playback and even Mpeg4 x264 and LPCM audio only pushes things to 75%.

At the moment CPU core temperatures (measured with Speedfan) show ~40 degrees idle and ~50-55 during BD x264 playback. NB also shows ~45-50 degrees C.

Once I get the new fans I will run some more detailed tests and probably something that will push the CPU to 100% for anextended period.


Total Budget ~ £700
I initially hoped to borrow more hardware from my existing PCs and only spend £400 for the case MB and CPU but I ended up having to buy every component new. I could have saved money here and there and did where I could but in the end I wanted it just right.


Initial Conclusions
I have thoroughly enjoyed this PC build, more than any other. There were more challenges but that what makes it fun and I feel I have done a good job although cable tidying still needs some work :oops:

I started off wanting a 'cheap as possible' HTPC and ended up with a 'Dream HTPC' and I am really happy with the results \:D/

_________________
HTPC | OrigenAE H6 | Asus P5E-VM HDMI | C2 Quad Q6600 | GeIL 2GB PC6400 | Samsung HD501LJ Local | 6TB Networked | LG HD & BD | Vista x86 Ultimate |
AV | Fujitsu 58 Series | SkyHD | Onkyo TX-SR875 | Cinepro 2K6 | XTZ 99.36 & 99.26 | M&K CS-22s | Xenon 36s | SVS PB13U | Velodyne SMS-1 |


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2007 10:16 am 
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ImageImage
Here she is; I decided on the brushed Aluminium finish in the end. I figured if i am buying an all Aluminium case then why have one painted black? Besides I knew I would scratch it at some point.


Image
Look how much room there is in here, this will be a cinch! 8)


Image
I never used an mATX MB before, awe ain't it cute :lol:


ImageImage
Yay finished, how easy was that? :D


ImageImage
Maybe I will change some fans over, what harm can that do right? Also how about improve the airflow with this 9db fan in the bottom of the case. I must be a pro now, customising the fan install :P


ImageImage
Here is the Zalman CPU fan, big beasty and I had to take the MB out to fit it. Worth it though wasn't it? Mope even with the fan controlled she thrummed like a Ho, I finally cured that by placing a step down resistor inline with the fan speed controller, however now it probably runs too slow. If you touch the dial at all the fan stops and the PC shuts down... eeek :shock:

Also the new Coolink fans need to use molex connectors with a step down resistor and then a sensor wire to the MB fan sockets. A bit of a 'wire intensive' setup but I don't care anymore. They are silent which is good.

ATM one of the rear exhaust fans (now Acoustifans) doesn't spin at all and the MB doesn't seem to controll the speeds at all, they are all on fill tilt. Even using Speedfan nothing I does alters the speeds. Pretty weird but hopefully I will get to the bottom of it today.

FWIW with all fans running flat out (no resistors) the Cores idle at 15-20 degrees C 8) but you wouldn't want it in the room with you. :lol:

The fans are a real pain in the arse but I am close to getting her nice and quiet. Although i think one or both of the WD Caviar drives in there are a little noisy, there is a kind of slow pulsing 'thrum' coming from the case... or maybe its the DVD drive. More fiddling needed!


ImageImage
Here she is in the rack, looks pretty good if I do say so myself :D

_________________
HTPC | OrigenAE H6 | Asus P5E-VM HDMI | C2 Quad Q6600 | GeIL 2GB PC6400 | Samsung HD501LJ Local | 6TB Networked | LG HD & BD | Vista x86 Ultimate |
AV | Fujitsu 58 Series | SkyHD | Onkyo TX-SR875 | Cinepro 2K6 | XTZ 99.36 & 99.26 | M&K CS-22s | Xenon 36s | SVS PB13U | Velodyne SMS-1 |


Last edited by AngelEyes on Wed May 16, 2007 7:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2007 10:27 am 
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Excellent project there. Its all worth it in the end, the challenges are all part of the fun. =D>

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Sony KDL40W2000 | Kef 1005 | Sony STRDA1200ES | HTPC: AMD X2 3800, 1GB RAM, Abit NF-M2 nView


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2007 10:45 am 
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Nice work Angel, that was a good detailed outline of your project, and am sure it's going to help a lot of people that will be drawn to this forum soon. It's kind of what this forum needs and what is going to make it different from others IMHO.

All thanks to Phil for starting this project, and understanding what people looking to build their 1st HTPC are after.

PS: How does the Abit F-190HD, compare to the Abit NF-M2 nview? Angeleyes, I don't know if the cpu cooler in the link below will help you

http://www.overclock3d.net/reviews.php? ... otherboard


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2007 12:55 pm 
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Thanks for the link, just installing my new cooler now, it was a shock when I got it I though it wasn't going to fit!

I am afriad I am not familiar with the Abit NF-M2 nview. One thing to note on the F-190HD is the lack of Firewire. I didn't even look out for it so it was a shock when it wasn't there... not a big deal but I will have to capture my Camcorder stuff on another PC :cry:

Give me 30mins to put this back together and I will upload some images!

Adam

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HTPC | OrigenAE H6 | Asus P5E-VM HDMI | C2 Quad Q6600 | GeIL 2GB PC6400 | Samsung HD501LJ Local | 6TB Networked | LG HD & BD | Vista x86 Ultimate |
AV | Fujitsu 58 Series | SkyHD | Onkyo TX-SR875 | Cinepro 2K6 | XTZ 99.36 & 99.26 | M&K CS-22s | Xenon 36s | SVS PB13U | Velodyne SMS-1 |


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2007 1:21 pm 
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Keen HTPCer
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Interesting really......the f-190hd seems to have hdmi and is hdcp compliant and doesn't have firewire. The nf-m2 nview on the other hand, has firewire, no hdmi and isn't hdcp compliant


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2007 2:23 pm 
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A+ so far my friend :D Great to have a detailed explanation like this and I'm very pleased that Vista 64 is working for you too - I was worried about that choice when you first mentioned it :P

Good job 8)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2007 4:11 pm 
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Keen HTPCer
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That explanation is the canine's testicles innit? :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 7:46 am 
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Thanks chaps, I finally added some pictures!

_________________
HTPC | OrigenAE H6 | Asus P5E-VM HDMI | C2 Quad Q6600 | GeIL 2GB PC6400 | Samsung HD501LJ Local | 6TB Networked | LG HD & BD | Vista x86 Ultimate |
AV | Fujitsu 58 Series | SkyHD | Onkyo TX-SR875 | Cinepro 2K6 | XTZ 99.36 & 99.26 | M&K CS-22s | Xenon 36s | SVS PB13U | Velodyne SMS-1 |


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 9:03 am 
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Looking good! Its so hard to keep control of all the cables and wires though. But, as long as its not obstructing airflow it doesnt matter as you cant see em with the case on :)

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Sony KDL40W2000 | Kef 1005 | Sony STRDA1200ES | HTPC: AMD X2 3800, 1GB RAM, Abit NF-M2 nView


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 9:10 am 
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I started off with good intentions but right now I am fed up with the damn thing and cable tidying is not on my agenda atm.

I now have the fans pretty much all set to their lowest sound/performance levels and the case is almost silent. However this has revealed that annoying HDD thrum I mentioned earlier which has really narked me off.

I have heard of some disk utilities that allow you to slow disks down so I may look into this although I think it maybe manufacturer specific?

_________________
HTPC | OrigenAE H6 | Asus P5E-VM HDMI | C2 Quad Q6600 | GeIL 2GB PC6400 | Samsung HD501LJ Local | 6TB Networked | LG HD & BD | Vista x86 Ultimate |
AV | Fujitsu 58 Series | SkyHD | Onkyo TX-SR875 | Cinepro 2K6 | XTZ 99.36 & 99.26 | M&K CS-22s | Xenon 36s | SVS PB13U | Velodyne SMS-1 |


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 9:55 am 
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I have been running a few performance / stability / cooling tests:

1. All fans running 100%, CPU idle - Core temps ~20 degrees C

2. All fans running 'silent mode', CPU idle - Core temps ~35 degrees C

3. All fans running in 'silent mode' Orthos 'blend' CPU & Ram stress test (20mins) CPU 100% - Core temps ~ 65 degrees C

4. All fans running in 'silent mode' Blu-Ray HDD playback of 'The Prestige' Mpeg4 x264 & LPCM 7.1 - Core temps ~45-50 degrees C

In all the above tests the HDD temps were all ~30 except for the top mounted (no fan) HDD which runs at 40 degrees C. The 'System' temp which I am asuming is the Northbridge runs at 40 degrees C which is significantly cooler with the Zalman Flower fan than the stock cpu cooler.

I think this is a pretty good performance for a very quiet HTPC and compares well to my P4 desktop that runs at 70 degrees C, just idling!

_________________
HTPC | OrigenAE H6 | Asus P5E-VM HDMI | C2 Quad Q6600 | GeIL 2GB PC6400 | Samsung HD501LJ Local | 6TB Networked | LG HD & BD | Vista x86 Ultimate |
AV | Fujitsu 58 Series | SkyHD | Onkyo TX-SR875 | Cinepro 2K6 | XTZ 99.36 & 99.26 | M&K CS-22s | Xenon 36s | SVS PB13U | Velodyne SMS-1 |


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 10:19 am 
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AngelEyes wrote:
I have been running a few performance / stability / cooling tests:

1. All fans running 100%, CPU idle - Core temps ~20 degrees C

2. All fans running 'silent mode', CPU idle - Core temps ~35 degrees C

3. All fans running in 'silent mode' Orthos 'blend' CPU & Ram stress test (20mins) CPU 100% - Core temps ~ 65 degrees C

4. All fans running in 'silent mode' Blu-Ray HDD playback of 'The Prestige' Mpeg4 x264 & LPCM 7.1 - Core temps ~45-50 degrees C

In all the above tests the HDD temps were all ~30 except for the top mounted (no fan) HDD which runs at 40 degrees C. The 'System' temp which I am asuming is the Northbridge runs at 40 degrees C which is significantly cooler with the Zalman Flower fan than the stock cpu cooler.

I think this is a pretty good performance for a very quiet HTPC and compares well to my P4 desktop that runs at 70 degrees C, just idling!


Good results there. These new CPU's are much better for temperature and energy efficiency, which is excellent news for HTPC users.

It seems the AMD x2 and Intel Core Duo are pretty similar temp wise. My CPU idles around 32C, I'll see how it does after playing some HD stuff.

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Sony KDL40W2000 | Kef 1005 | Sony STRDA1200ES | HTPC: AMD X2 3800, 1GB RAM, Abit NF-M2 nView


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 12:11 pm 
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Wow...looks good mate, and good choice on the finish :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 12:41 pm 
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Thanks very much for the pics (I'd better get myself a digital camera from somewhere :shock: )

Which model Zalman CPU HSF did you get? And does it fit without removing the motherboard from the case?


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